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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Okay, this is not an original thought I have to admit right off the bat. Kiel is asking the same thing about Utah over at RME. But after having a chance to drive those basalt crack this summer I am curious what else you would rank up near the top.
 

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Due to alot of conservation issues, Im sure some of the most difficult trails will remain unnamed.


There was one, rattlesnake alley that was mentioned in petersons UA trip.
 

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I think the difficulty level of any trail would be determined by experience and equiptment set up, easy for some is impossible to others. Extreme trails for extreme rigs are also determind by the weather and total usage. the more they're run the less challenge they become. The only way to keep things really interesting is by constantly looking for new areas to run.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Due to alot of conservation issues, Im sure some of the most difficult trails will remain unnamed.
That is curious, the opposite is true in Utah. Since most of the public lands are under going travel plans right now establishing and mapping the existence of trails is key. We have a list of trails that is being compiled by the clubs and the association for submittal to the governors office. We also have been attending various county meetings as they establish area plans. So we are hopeful that the openness and documentation will gain us new and legal trails to use in the future.

I understand not wanting to give turn by turn directions though. Clubs should protect access in my opinion. You found it, you have the choice to not publicize it. When you have ownership or al least responsibility for upkeep it makes for a better experience.

I was just curious. Kind of fun to talk about the hard ones. Since the jeep is up on blocks till easter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I think the difficulty level of any trail would be determined by experience and equiptment set up, easy for some is impossible to others. Extreme trails for extreme rigs are also determind by the weather and total usage. the more they're run the less challenge they become. The only way to keep things really interesting is by constantly looking for new areas to run.
True. I was looking for the hard ones as rated on a "Moab" scale. Not necessarily what was hard when it wet and such. More "this rivals the rubi or pritchett" stuff.
 

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Pritchett isn't that tough anymore, and there have been way too many bypasses made. We have several trails in the Owyhees that at least rival Pritchett for difficulty. The difference between the trails in Idaho and those in Moab is great. Our trails are mostly lava rock and undergo a lot of change each season. The rock is fairly soft and can be crushed fairly easily. It is jagged and sharp and hard on tires. Also the rocks move when they break off adding to the difficulty at times. Traction is completely different. Another thing that is different is our trails are fairly short in comparison as they are typically found in valleys and washes. We don't have the deep and wide canyons like Moab.

There is a difference between sharing trail information with the BLM and broadcasting it in an open forum. By reducing the amount of people on the trail it reduces trail use and it also keeps people who monitor lists like this who aren't in the 4wd commnity from knowing exactly where it is we really are.
 

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But the whole sprite of 4 wheeling is for everybody and when a few think they should be the only ones to use a trail(just because they found it) but think every one should help keep it open then it is not in the sprit of the real 4 wheel(or out doorsman) it is just for the selfish few.
 

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in my opinion 4-wheeling is about getting to know others that enjoy the hobbie also, and care about keeping the land open for public use. if you go out an be active in the 4 wheel community then you more that likely will get to know where these trails and respect that someone wants to keep it private. i know every one thinks they mean well but eventually when shit get popular too many people go and it gets trashed somehow. just my 2 cents!:thumb:

trev:beer:
 

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It's not being selfish, it's being smart IMO.

Look at it this way, do you hunt?

Let's say you find a spot that there's 100s of deer. No crap, they just walk out with a target hanging on their side even :rotfl:

Now would you tell everyone and their brother about this spot??

NOPE!

Is there some sort of "law" or "rule" that says you must?

NO WAY!

Same thing for wheeling.
 

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But the whole sprite of 4 wheeling is for everybody and when a few think they should be the only ones to use a trail(just because they found it) but think every one should help keep it open then it is not in the sprit of the real 4 wheel(or out doorsman) it is just for the selfish few.
I am not sure exactly what you are saying here because of your (lack of)spelling and punctuation but if I understand correctly, you are saying that it is selfish for people to keep some trails secret? I have not participated in any "secret" trail finding and running but I happen to agree with the folks that do.

I have personally seen some of our best and hardest local trails reduced to almost paved roads. Why is it that people that do not have a vehicle built enough for a trail in its current state feel necessary to modify the trail to get thier lesser equipped vehicles through? Rock stacking and trail modification is necessary at times but to stack rocks (AND LEAVE THEM STACKED!) the entire length kind of defeats the purpose.:rolleyes:

Take a look at these two pictures of the same obstacle the first picture is from 2000




The second from 2006



Notice how small the obstacle looks now? Notice the liberal amount of rocks stacked? This is why people keep trails secret.

There are trails in Idaho that rival some of the most hardcore around but if advertised they will become like the above trail.
 

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and if a few people keep it to their self then when it is being closed why should everybody help to keep it open?
 

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and if a few people keep it to their self then when it is being closed why should everybody help to keep it open?
Valid point - but the people that keep "some" trails secret are also the MOST active in keeping ALL of our trails open.
 

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As I found out, If you want to know the hardest trails in Idaho you just need to get ahold of the local clubs. They will not post up locations here. That does not mean they won't be more than happy for you to join a run with them out to some of their prides and joy. As far as hard trails in Idaho, there are some hard enough to bitch slap the rigs of Ultimate adventure. That should speak volumes.
 

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Valid point - but the people that keep "some" trails secret are also the MOST active in keeping ALL of our trails open.
Both have vaild points. We need to find a balance of getting the numbers in membership to trail managment. All trails at some point must incure some type of maintenace.
 

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Valid point - but the people that keep "some" trails secret are also the MOST active in keeping ALL of our trails open.

A perfect point - there is no better point to make.


I am an open forum guy, but this is my same point of view.

Trevor made the inclusion clause perfectly clear, but I want to add a little reasoning. I hate to seem like an ass here, but the better built your rig is the more time you have spent working on the entire culture. If you are more familiar with the culture, then you are working on the cure, or keeping stuff open. When stuff starts closing, then we see a better participation, but even then, there are lots of fairweather fans. I would like to see better teamwork and better participation year round. Just my hope. Sorry to rant.

To address the question, I need to make it to Moab before I compare, but the rocks on the west side of the state compare to the rocks at Menan Buttes (near Rexburg). Those were great and I really enjoyed that little play area. Just like those lava rocks, the rocks over here crumble and settle, you cannot count on a trail looking the same the next time you visit.
 

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This whole idea of "hardest" trail seems to be in the eye of the beholder. Are we talking day trips on the rocks? Or longer trips like a 3 day run where parts are scarce and you survive with whats on hand (Rubicon or White Rim). You can make a tough day out of just about anywhere, what I look for is a challenging outing with some like minded people enjoying a sport we all love.
BTW - any of you on the western side of the state ever travel out to the Oregon-Idaho-Nevada corner/boarder? Looks like it could be a long out-of the way trip that could be a challenge.
 

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So far the hardest trail I have ran in this area is the right side of 2HD...


I thought it was on par or harder then pritchet.
 

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Tripple T,

A lot of that errosion in Carnage Canyon has nothing to do with 4wd use. A lot of it just has to do with the nature of the wheeling is a wash, it is the nature of the beast. Mother nature does its fair share of filling in holes and rocky regions each winter. This year Mother Nature hit some of those trails really hard in the spring with the massive amounts of rain. I was surprised at how much that trail changed from Feb. 2006 to April 2006.

Look at the entrance to Meat Grinder and look off to the left of the wall. The first time I ran that trail the dirt came all the way to the edge of the ledge. Now there is about 20 feet of washout. This washout has nothing to do with 4wd traffic as I know of nobody who has ever tried to bypass the first ledge by heading up to the upper road. It is merely where the water turned to run to the lowest point. If you are going to wheel in a wash you have to expect these sorts of changes.

You are saying your first photo is in 2000. I have some photos of the very first running of that trail and that rock is much taller even in them. It is amazing how a wash will fill in.

I totally agree with you on some of the other trails. I've seen some trails go from insane to lame in less than 2 years.
 

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So far the hardest trail I have ran in this area is the right side of 2HD...


I thought it was on par or harder then pritchet.
I would agree with that comparison. I've never run the right side of 2HD. However, 2HD dragon is what a 1/4 mile long? Whereas Pritchett is really pretty easy until the last mile where it is just obstacle after obstacle. Longevity should rate in trail ratings some how.

A lot of difficulty is a wheelbase thing. Some wheelbases are heavily favored over others on some trails. When I've traveled to differenc Land Cruiser events across the country it is amazing to see how rigs are built differently in different areas to deal with the variances in local terrain.
 
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